if you're in for nostalgia, prepare to be disappointed

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dap
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if you're in for nostalgia, prepare to be disappointed

Post by dap »

I have looked at the trailer and you can tell this title targets very young audience of kids/early teenage boys so get ready for all the shounen tropes (shallow writing, overly simplistic characters, childish humor, good vs evil, save the world from total destruction, and so on...) If you're in for a nostalgia trip prepare to be disappointed, unless you managed to remain a kid inside after decades, the shounen tropes should be quickly unbearable and the game should be the opposite of what made Suikoden special.

I am definitely not going to jump on this one without watching some longplay footage. But I am already 90% confident this will be a huge disappoint to most suikoden fans. It would make no sense for a corporation to release a game that targets a mature audience when a younger audience has a much better potential for decent sales.
Antimatzist
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Re: if you're in for nostalgia, prepare to be disappointed

Post by Antimatzist »

I've got to say, you always know a lot of things about games you haven't even played yet.

Don't know how you got the idea though.
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Vextor
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Re: if you're in for nostalgia, prepare to be disappointed

Post by Vextor »

I don't think the data agrees with this opinion.

Eiyuden Chronicles was the most successful Kickstarter campaign for Japan-developed game in history, and was the most successful campaign in 2020.
The game is developed by the creator of the series himself, Yoshitaka Murayama along with key members such as Junko Kawano and Osamu Komuta.

Yoshitaka Murayama is an established scenario writer who has been heavily influenced by the fantasy genre in the "West" (in a general sense), including the Eternal Champions series (Elric Saga) which Suikoden borrows heavily from, the works of JRR Tolkein, and HP Lovecraft. After quitting Konami, he has had a lot of freedom to pursue whatever media he wants, and finally he is returning to making JRPGs by the strong request of fans -- which is why he received such significant funding from Suikoden fans (who are not young people at all).

The Suikoden series touches on multiple levels of deep themes which may not be apparent at first glance -- or unless you have the perception to notice them. The writing is very subtle in that sense and doesn't outright tell you what you should understand. As a result, the story seems very different depending on your own condition. For example, a parent would see the story of Suikoden very differently and would identify with certain characters completely differently than some other fan.

For me, it's the overall historical element of how each installation is not about "saving the world" but focused on local conflicts within the same world, and how it is largely focused on drama and intrigue between nations of people (and I include other races like Elves and Dwarves within "people"). Eiyuden seems to follow a similar type of setting / character structure which is why I am looking forward to it.
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JuveLeo
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Re: if you're in for nostalgia, prepare to be disappointed

Post by JuveLeo »

Might want to wait until the game is released before criticizing it. Game looks great in my opinion, but I guess we'll all see once it's out.
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patapi
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Re: if you're in for nostalgia, prepare to be disappointed

Post by patapi »

If even the original Suikoden crew can't recapture the magic of the old series, then perhaps there is no hope.
dap
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Re: if you're in for nostalgia, prepare to be disappointed

Post by dap »

patapi wrote: Wed Nov 15, 2023 4:01 am If even the original Suikoden crew can't recapture the magic of the old series, then perhaps there is no hope.
it is very common for a video game creator or an artist in general to not be able to reproduce a critical success. the best example is FF7 which universal acclaim was never matched by any other entry in the franchise. but I could name many more, nier replicant didn't get even close to nier automata, fromsoftware admitted they were never able to reproduce the first dark souls in terms of level design and lore.

anyway my opinion is based on the trailer which shows an enormous amount of shounen tropes and that doesn't bode well. the game will most likely target a very young audience (around 12yo) and most suikoden nostalgic fans who are in their 30s or even 40s may end getting bitterly disappointed if they expect a mature setting.

the situation of the developer is very different now. they no longer work for a AAA publisher like konami and the JRPG genre has declined into a niche genre nowadays. that means less budget and less expectation for the sales, they will be lucky if they sell just 1 million copies. they are on thin ice and will attempt to combine the sales they can make from a generic JRPG and from the reputation of the Suikoden classics even if the two are fundamentally different. at least that's what I would do if I were the game director, I would definitely not take the risk to make a game that wouldn't appeal to kids because the chance it would break even would be extremely low.
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Re: if you're in for nostalgia, prepare to be disappointed

Post by Antimatzist »

I'm really not sure whether you're here just to troll, but some of these statements are ... very off. Can you maybe elaborate why you think this game is made at 14 year olds? i simply can't follow your logic here.
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Re: if you're in for nostalgia, prepare to be disappointed

Post by Calvin »

You made an interesting comment about development and not working for a AAA developer anymore. Not sure I agree with it, though I may have 20 years ago. The current state of technology allows people to do more than they ever have before with less. First, Rabbit & Bear ran one of the most successful kickstarter campaigns in history, raising over $3 million--something that didn't exist in the late nineties. Second, the rapid expansion of the internet and the ability to work remotely has dramatically reduced the overhead of companies who allow employees to work from home -- I don't know if Rabbit & Bear have done this but I do remember seeing pictures of them at work in what looks like home offices during the pandemic. Third, access to hardware and software, as well as the design of SDKs and such for said software, has become very robust and easy to use, allowing more people to get into it and do more with less. Finally, distributors don't really act as gatekeepers in the same way they did in the past: developers can put their game on steam or another digital marketplace and find success. Simply put, I think it is probably easier to make a game now than at any time in history.

I'm not a video game creator, but I do work in a technology field and have had these experiences personally, which is why I imagine it to be similar with video games. And just look at the explosion of successful indie titles in the recent past from non-AAA developers. The maker of BG3 started off as a little indie kickstarter company too. Stardew Valley was literally made by 1 guy. Etc.
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