"New" Suikoden Trademark

[eldrasidar]

it would also explain the marked difference in quality between the two versions( see: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digit ... i-face-off ). I would guess that square-enix has different agreements with Sony and Microsoft in the U.S. and in Japan.

[Antimatzist]

Well, this is certainly interesting, even though I don't think it is very probable. I still hope we get any news - an announcement alone would be enough for me. They just need to tell me "Suikoden VI will come in 2011" and I would have no problem with that.

[skymansxeno]

Any rumor is better than having nothing like we have for years now (on a main title). I will be watching TGS closely not only for this but many other things. It might turn out to be a really good TGS this year.

[LanceHeart]

Think of it this way: Microsoft went through the humongous trouble of making Star Ocean 4 and Infinite Undiscovery the major highlights of their past TGS showings. They weren't necessarily good or popular games in relation to, say, Dragon Quest. But they were exclusive and on 360. Sony did the same with White Knight Chronicles, somewhat less with Valkyria Chronicles 2 (first one was largely ignored by Sony until it franchised out into an anime).

Unless Sony is sitting on something of Monster Hunter PS3 proportions for TGS, expect them to pay attention to games like Suikoden if they're exclusive.

Uh WAT on the bolded part?

Valkyria Chronicles (first one, PS3 game) was largely left to its own devices in Japan, which led to it being noticed only after it got an anime. Sony made sure VC2 was promoted as part of their TGS lineup for the PSP, though. I'm guessing your WAT was directed at VC2 being a PSP game rather than a PS3 one.
In North America, Valkyria Chronicles' public Sony connection pretty much ended with E3, unless you actually read the PlayStation Blog. One of the social media managers (Jeff Rubenstein) is a big fan of Valkyria Chronicles, so he kind of went on his own to help promote the game.

Microsoft made a big deal out of SO4 and IU because they're desperate for Japanese fans. RPGs are still a popular genre there, and Microsoft wrongly assumed that if they had some big name RPGs, then they'd be a competitive player in the Japanese market.

Sony doesn't have to worry about this. The PS3 is dueling it out each week with the Wii and the DS, and they're more or less even on even terms (unless Nintendo releases one of their own games). As far as the Japanese market goes...people still see Sony as the RPG machine. SO4 eventually came out for the PS3, and Tales of Vesperia eventually came out for the PS3, Final Fantasy XIII was PS3 only, XIV is PC and PS3 only, Tales of Graces (for the Wii) is getting a PS3 port, there's a new Tales game coming out only for the PS3. Add to that, Sony has a good relationship with Atlus, Nippon Ichi, Idea Factory, so they'll get all those other RPGs like the Atelier series, Disgaea, Persona, Ar Tonelico, etc.,

AS I commented on KoRnholio's post...Suikoden series is a popular series, but I don't think it'd be a system seller. Sony has no reason to waste significant resources on helping Konami market the game. Sony isn't as desperate for a Suikoden as we are.

With Atlus' first HD game being multiplatform, Nippon Ichi being almost down the drain (canceling 3 unrevealed projects recently), and Idea Factory also barely staying afloat, Sony truly is in trouble when it comes to RPG exclusives from brand names people recognize in Japan.

Don't be surprised if games like TRINITY: Souls of Zill O'll and Ni no Kuni are endorsed by Sony in some way at TGS since they're the only "exclusives" Sony has on the RPG front that have been fully revealed. If Disgaea 4, the new Tales game, the newly rumored Valkyria Chronicles 3 and this Suikoden 6 rumor were to be revealed at TGS, you can bet that Sony will want to have a hand in reminding people that their systems are a place to play RPGs.

[Vextor]

Further information revealed is that Hideo Kojima will be making an announcement at TGS about a "secret PS3 exclusive title." If Game Lab's "rumor" was about this, then it seems unlikely that this would be Suikoden, because Hideo Kojima is basically the Metal Gear Solid creator, and has personally stated repeatedly that he only makes games that he'd like to play himself (and his favorite genre is FPS and doesn't include J-RPGs).

However, Hideo Kojima is also the current CCO (Chief Creative Director) of Konami, so may be possible he'll announce Konami's new product (such as Suikoden) from his CCO capacity, and also as a way to use Kojima's star power to generate more buzz for the series.

Well, one could dream I suppose...

[LanceHeart]

I'm guessing any "secret PS3 exclusive" from Kojima will be Kojima Productions related. Metal Gear Solid (Peace Walker PS3, perhaps) or Zone of the Enders will definitely be at the top of the list.

Boktai/Lunar Knights is out of the question, but Suikoden could be a possibility if they go outside of KPs IPs. Besides, what other franchises does Konami have that were exclusive to PlayStation throughout the PSOne and PS2 generations? We've seen them throw Vandal Hearts to the wayside (they subcontracted the newest game and made it a downloadable title), so what's left? (I'm well aware of Card Stories...)

[daoster]

Valkyria Chronicles (first one, PS3 game) was largely left to its own devices in Japan, which led to it being noticed only after it got an anime. Sony made sure VC2 was promoted as part of their TGS lineup for the PSP, though. I'm guessing your WAT was directed at VC2 being a PSP game rather than a PS3 one.
In North America, Valkyria Chronicles' public Sony connection pretty much ended with E3, unless you actually read the PlayStation Blog. One of the social media managers (Jeff Rubenstein) is a big fan of Valkyria Chronicles, so he kind of went on his own to help promote the game.

I don't remember much from the TGS that VC 1 was announced, but IIRC, when Valkyria Chronicles was announced initially, it was slated as a PS3/360 game as well, and then later, switched to being a PS3 exclusive. But why does Sony have to do anything? Valkyria Chronciles was Sega's game, and thus, it's Sega's responsibility to market the game, not Sony's. The anime was made because the first game sold decently for a new IP on the PS3, and proved to be a fan favorite. Being mentioned in TGS (or E3, or GamesCom) that it's exclusive shouldn't come as a surprise though. These shows are basically chances for the companies to show off, so of course they're going to be showing off exclusives.

If Suikoden VI is released on the PS3, and Konami is indeed announcing it this TGS, I also fully expect Sony to mention it in their press conference, but beyond that, I don't see them doing much beyond that.

With Atlus' first HD game being multiplatform, Nippon Ichi being almost down the drain (canceling 3 unrevealed projects recently), and Idea Factory also barely staying afloat, Sony truly is in trouble when it comes to RPG exclusives from brand names people recognize in Japan.

Don't be surprised if games like TRINITY: Souls of Zill O'll and Ni no Kuni are endorsed by Sony in some way at TGS since they're the only "exclusives" Sony has on the RPG front that have been fully revealed. If Disgaea 4, the new Tales game, the newly rumored Valkyria Chronicles 3 and this Suikoden 6 rumor were to be revealed at TGS, you can bet that Sony will want to have a hand in reminding people that their systems are a place to play RPGs.

You've said that Sony is in trouble when it comes to RPG exclusives from brand names, but then you mentioned some recognizable brands that ARE coming to the PS3: Tales, Disgaea, and the rumored VC3 (which I really do hope goes back onto consoles, as opposed to handheld). Final Fantasy vXIII and Final Fantasy XIV are also a huge brand name that's still PS3 only. Atlus' new game might be multi (and IIRC, it's not even an RPG), but I also expect Persona 5 to be a PS3 exclusive.

Ni no Kuni is game that was originally announced only for the DS, a system that the PS3 will never ever reach in terms of sales, and they're still making a PS3 version of the game. I mean, that should at least tell you that the PS3 is still seen as an RPG system (at least in Japan).

But maybe I'm not understanding you correctly...what do you mean by Sony "endorsing" these games?

Further information revealed is that Hideo Kojima will be making an announcement at TGS about a "secret PS3 exclusive title." If Game Lab's "rumor" was about this, then it seems unlikely that this would be Suikoden, because Hideo Kojima is basically the Metal Gear Solid creator, and has personally stated repeatedly that he only makes games that he'd like to play himself (and his favorite genre is FPS and doesn't include J-RPGs).

Don't be surprised if this secret PS3 title is Peace Walker...FOR THE PS3! With the way Konami's profit is almost solely dependent on the Metal Gear series these days...I would not be surprised...

[Raww Le Klueze]

Further information revealed is that Hideo Kojima will be making an announcement at TGS about a "secret PS3 exclusive title." If Game Lab's "rumor" was about this, then it seems unlikely that this would be Suikoden, because Hideo Kojima is basically the Metal Gear Solid creator, and has personally stated repeatedly that he only makes games that he'd like to play himself (and his favorite genre is FPS and doesn't include J-RPGs).

Isn't he currently doing something with that Suda51 guy that did No More Heros anyway? Something related to Snatcher.

[LanceHeart]

I don't remember much from the TGS that VC 1 was announced, but IIRC, when Valkyria Chronicles was announced initially, it was slated as a PS3/360 game as well, and then later, switched to being a PS3 exclusive. But why does Sony have to do anything? Valkyria Chronciles was Sega's game, and thus, it's Sega's responsibility to market the game, not Sony's. The anime was made because the first game sold decently for a new IP on the PS3, and proved to be a fan favorite. Being mentioned in TGS (or E3, or GamesCom) that it's exclusive shouldn't come as a surprise though. These shows are basically chances for the companies to show off, so of course they're going to be showing off exclusives.

If Suikoden VI is released on the PS3, and Konami is indeed announcing it this TGS, I also fully expect Sony to mention it in their press conference, but beyond that, I don't see them doing much beyond that.

Name dropping games isn't something Sony usually does outside of E3, actually. Sony went through the trouble of promoting Valkyria Chronicles on their news show, but VC2 got an actual section on the PS store. Sure, they didn't take the entire marketing to the street or anything, but it's more than they do for many other releases on the PS3 or PSP.

You've said that Sony is in trouble when it comes to RPG exclusives from brand names, but then you mentioned some recognizable brands that ARE coming to the PS3: Tales, Disgaea, and the rumored VC3 (which I really do hope goes back onto consoles, as opposed to handheld). Final Fantasy vXIII and Final Fantasy XIV are also a huge brand name that's still PS3 only. Atlus' new game might be multi (and IIRC, it's not even an RPG), but I also expect Persona 5 to be a PS3 exclusive.

Ni no Kuni is game that was originally announced only for the DS, a system that the PS3 will never ever reach in terms of sales, and they're still making a PS3 version of the game. I mean, that should at least tell you that the PS3 is still seen as an RPG system (at least in Japan).

But maybe I'm not understanding you correctly...what do you mean by Sony "endorsing" these games?

You're heavily overestimating how big Disgaea and Valkyria Chronicles are. Suikoden sells in the same range as them in terms of copies sold and is supposed to be an older, waning series in comparison to those two.
Ni no Kuni was always announced for "DS and another platform". Everyone assumed it would be the Wii, but everyone's jaw fell off when the game was announced for PS3 and promised to be "Ghibli animation" in terms of graphical quality.

As for "endorsing", it's exactly that: Making a newscast on Toro and Kuro's weekly show, making a fully featured section for the game on the store, adding the games to montage trailers, mentioning it as part of the upcoming Sony platform games lineup, posting about the games on the regional blogs, etc. Basically, Sony will promote the games rather than say "just look at the list in your press kit, that's what's coming out".

Isn't he currently doing something with that Suda51 guy that did No More Heros anyway? Something related to Snatcher.

He's also doing something with the director of 5pb. Then again, "Project S" was mentioned well over a year ago and didn't show up for any game shows since then nor has it been mentioned at all by either director.

[thcrock]

Further information revealed is that Hideo Kojima will be making an announcement at TGS about a "secret PS3 exclusive title." If Game Lab's "rumor" was about this, then it seems unlikely that this would be Suikoden, because Hideo Kojima is basically the Metal Gear Solid creator, and has personally stated repeatedly that he only makes games that he'd like to play himself (and his favorite genre is FPS and doesn't include J-RPGs).

Isn't he currently doing something with that Suda51 guy that did No More Heros anyway? Something related to Snatcher.

Kojima usually has multiple projects ongoing, of varied involvement. He wouldn't work on Suikoden itself, but if he's the Chief Creative Director at Konami now, he could easily talk about games he's not directly involved in. In fact, after E3, Konami should just have Kojima do all of their PR for them.

[Vextor]

After some further searching, Kojima has been saying his announcement will "break some industry taboos, and if this fails I will have to leave the industry." I have no idea what this can mean.

He's also been working on a "Project S" which most people say the "s" stands for "Snatcher" (another of his series), but "s" also stands for another game series if I'm not mistaken...

[Hirathien]

After some further searching, Kojima has been saying his announcement will "break some industry taboos, and if this fails I will have to leave the industry." I have no idea what this can mean.

He's also been working on a "Project S" which most people say the "s" stands for "Snatcher" (another of his series), but "s" also stands for another game series if I'm not mistaken...

Superman?

[Raww Le Klueze]

Project S was confirmed by Suda51 to be about Snatcher so not much hope there.

I'd rather not see Kojima or Suda work on Suikoden anyway. Kojima likes convoluted storytelling for the sake of convoluted storytelling. Suda... has a wicked sense of humor. Or I should say a really funny lack of one.

[LanceHeart]

The biggest thing about Suikoden is that it takes itself seriously within its own universe. Even passing jokes end up being part of the universe's history (Schtolteheim Reinbach anyone?). That's something Kojima has a very hard time with and something Suda has never actually managed to pull off in any of his games.

Edit: Just to stay on-topic... Konami has under 4 months left to publish anything that uses the Genso Suikoden trademark or it expires. That means unveiling at least *something* related to Suikoden for America before the end of the year.

After some further searching, Kojima has been saying his announcement will "break some industry taboos, and if this fails I will have to leave the industry." I have no idea what this can mean.

That's a very bold statement. One that has people speculating about it being an erotic game (or something borderline like Catherine is trying to be for Atlus), an RPG, or even something Katamari Damacy-esque in terms of how trippy it could be.

[daoster]

Name dropping games isn't something Sony usually does outside of E3, actually. Sony went through the trouble of promoting Valkyria Chronicles on their news show, but VC2 got an actual section on the PS store. Sure, they didn't take the entire marketing to the street or anything, but it's more than they do for many other releases on the PS3 or PSP.

Eh, I'll take your word for it on the Valkyria Chronicles part, as I've been looking around the Japanese PSN store, but can't find anything like a special Valkyria Chronicles section in the PSN section (other than an area that lists all the DLC for both games).

You're heavily overestimating how big Disgaea and Valkyria Chronicles are. Suikoden sells in the same range as them in terms of copies sold and is supposed to be an older, waning series in comparison to those two.
Ni no Kuni was always announced for "DS and another platform". Everyone assumed it would be the Wii, but everyone's jaw fell off when the game was announced for PS3 and promised to be "Ghibli animation" in terms of graphical quality.

So you're saying Disgaea and Valkyria Chronciles aren't "brand names"? Disgaea is a game that's had multiple spin-offs and remakes, as well as an anime series. Valkyria Chronicles is a brand new IP that's already gotten an anime series, and it looks like they're already gearing up to announce the next iteration. Suikoden is a series that hasn't seen a "main" game since 2006, and since the release of a side game for the DS, the series has all but been forgotten by people that aren't the Suikoden faithful. Now I'm not saying Valkyria Chronicles or Disgaea are necessarily bigger series than the Suikoden series (though who knows, with the way Konami's treated it, I wouldn't be surprised), but I was merely listing some series that are "brand name" RPGs that, thus so far, have been largely exclusive to Sony. Like I said in an earlier, unfortunately, Sony doesn't need Suikoden as much as we need one.

As for Ni no Kuni...Wii is also a system that's had more numbers than PS3 in it's lifetime sales. The fact that it's going to the PS3, rather than the Wii, should tell you that the companies still view Sony's Playstation 3 as the RPG machine, despite a numbers disadvantage to the Wii.

As for "endorsing", it's exactly that: Making a newscast on Toro and Kuro's weekly show, making a fully featured section for the game on the store, adding the games to montage trailers, mentioning it as part of the upcoming Sony platform games lineup, posting about the games on the regional blogs, etc. Basically, Sony will promote the games rather than say "just look at the list in your press kit, that's what's coming out".

Well, we should keep an eye out on how Sony will treat the upcoming exclusive Tales game. It'll give us an idea how Sony might treat Suikoden VI if it were announced. Stuff like talking about the game in their regional blogs are easy enough...Sony basically lets the people who've worked on those games talk about it themselves.

All this back forth over a rumor that might or might not be true.... GameLabs isn't known to be a reliable source, but here's hoping this rumor is true.