Is Killer rune underrated?

[gildedtalon]

On suikoden 1, I equipped everyone with killer rune except the holy rune bearer, coz it's available so early and not ridiculously overpriced like when you want to buy it in other suikodens

I'm not exactly a fan of magic, unless I want to do a speedrun

Maybe we all should do a killer rune playthrough in all suikodens, maybe we can discover something new and funny

[ninjaluc79]

Well, there really isn't any other way to boost your physical damage in Suikoden 1 except *Killer, *Double-Beat, command runes and unite attacks. Moreover, the MGC stat really matters in S1 more than in any other Suikoden game (where physicals always trump magic anyway) because there were no elemental affinities but more MP charges for mages.

In Suikoden 1, Luc and Crowley can easily have 9/9/9/9 MP if you so wish. In later Suikodens however, you have to be lucky to get 9/9/7/5 MP for your army's strongest usable magician.

Back to topic, from Suikoden 2 onwards, Killer Runes have become obsolete because of the game-breaking Double-Beat/Double-Strike/Fury combination (cranked Up to Eleven in S5 with the Crazed Rune replacing or combined with Fury).

Even characters with the highest SKL and LUCK in Suikoden top out at only 20-25% even with the Killer Rune equipped.

So what would you choose? A single rune that only adds 10% chance tops to inflict 2x-3x damage, or a single rune that lets you inflict the same damage 100% of the time? You know what you would choose.

[gildedtalon]

So sad, it used to be one of the reasons I think that Georg is the coolest and strongest character in the Suikoden world

[sticky-runes]

Well suikoden 4 dumbed down the variety of runes that 2, 3 and 5 had to offer, so I would attach killer and draining runes to characters who had the available slots, increasing their chance of delivering critical AND gaining health.

[Piisuke]

The Killer Rune is a good rune for physical attackers, but I tend to use the Double Beat Rune in the final dungeon for Viktor, as that's guaranteed to double damage each turn, where the Killer Rune doesn't and has a chance to miss as well when the opponent dodges the attack.

I wouldn't say the Killer Rune is underrated, but rather, there's better options available.

[gildedtalon]

On suikoden 1, critical only deals 2x damage?

[Piisuke]

Not entirely certain, but I do believe it's 200% damage. If someone could clarify this, that'd be great.

[wataru14]

In Suikoden 1 the Killer Rune is one of the best you're going to get for your big slow heavy hitters. It's not going to do very much, but it's probably your best option. I never give Viktor the Double Beat Rune. If he's going to miss and get counterattacked, I'd rather it happen only once in a round, thank you. Viktor is a great character in terms of personality, but (at least in my playthroughs of S1) he is next to useless in combat because his Skill growth is so low he can't hit anything. If you have him fight enemies like Ninjas or Elite Soldiers, all he will do is get counterattacked. I give him the Clone Rune. At least it has a 100% hit rate. True, the Double Beat Rune may be helpful against the Golden Hydra on Viktor, but if you choose three good people to round out your party, Viktor can go on Mega Medicine detail and you'll still win easily.

[Punkaiser]

On suikoden 1, critical only deals 2x damage?

S1: 3x damage
S2: 3x damage
S3: either 2x or 3x (ignore defence)
S4: 2x
S5: either 2x or 3x, (only Georg has the unique charge attack that works similar to crit hit)

I wouldn't say the Killer Rune is underrated, but rather, there's better options available.

So true.

he is next to useless in combat because his Skill growth is so low he can't hit anything. If you have him fight enemies like Ninjas or Elite Soldiers, all he will do is get counterattacked. I give him the Clone Rune.

that's why he needs Mangoshes more than power rings.

[Piisuke]

In Suikoden 1 the Killer Rune is one of the best you're going to get for your big slow heavy hitters. It's not going to do very much, but it's probably your best option. I never give Viktor the Double Beat Rune. If he's going to miss and get counterattacked, I'd rather it happen only once in a round, thank you. Viktor is a great character in terms of personality, but (at least in my playthroughs of S1) he is next to useless in combat because his Skill growth is so low he can't hit anything. If you have him fight enemies like Ninjas or Elite Soldiers, all he will do is get counterattacked. I give him the Clone Rune. At least it has a 100% hit rate. True, the Double Beat Rune may be helpful against the Golden Hydra on Viktor, but if you choose three good people to round out your party, Viktor can go on Mega Medicine detail and you'll still win easily.

Or use Luc, or Crowley with the Cyclone Rune. Enough healing and offense right there in one single spell. Sure, it doesn't hit one of the heads, but this is where Viktor with his double-beat rune comes into play. At least, this is how I've used him in the past.
His SPD is too low for me to use Mega Medicine and medicines are single target only.

[wataru14]

Or use Luc, or Crowley with the Cyclone Rune. Enough healing and offense right there in one single spell.

Exactly. My usual setup includes that. Usually Luc.

But Viktor's speed isn't that bad. He's much faster than most (if not all) of the other big hitters. He's not Krin my any stretch, but he's usually third or fourth in my initiative order. But what I'm talking bout is the Killer Rune vs the Double Beat Rune on Viktor for not just the final boss. For general use in gameplay. Against regular enemies, Viktor misses a lot. Who cares if he does a ton of damage when he hits? He never hits. Ever. It's the same reason I don't use FuSuLu. A Double Beat Rune means he misses twice as much. And against enemies with a high Skill rating he will get counterattacked. Use free will against Ninja Masters outside Gregminster, or against the Elite Soldiers in Shasarazade, to see what I mean. With a Killer Rune, he will crit more (even if it's just a little) and therefore he will hit more. Generally I make Viktor Clone Rune on turn 1, then heal whoever needs it, then Clone Rune again. Lather, rinse, repeat. That way his damage output evens out to normal over multiple rounds. It's better than him swinging and missing twice.

[Piisuke]

I tend to abuse Tir's Soul Eater through those dungeons to kill enemies, the instant kill spells, as well as Crowley's offensive spells. Especially the Soul Eater is great, as it just wipes out enemies for shits and gigs.
I do agree with you, but I just tend to have Viktor attack other enemies, i.e. the Colossus, as opposed to the Mirages, or whatever they're called in Gregminster.

Edit: Viktor is fairly sturdy as well, so I know he can take a couple of hits, so I'm okay with the Double Beat Rune.

[gildedtalon]

Viktor definitely needs mangosh(s) if you want to equip him with Double-beat