Suikoden VI: The Beast Rune Wars?

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Hiyato
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Suikoden VI: The Beast Rune Wars?

Post by Hiyato »

If anyone remembers from the ending of Suikoden V:

---
Chizen Star: Levi
To break Ernst's curse he starts from the beginning, traveling with Ernst
and Norma across the western sea.

Tensatsu Star: Ernst
Returns home with Norma and Levi and turns toward the ruins where his curse began.

Tenyu Star: Norma
With Levi alongside, goes to her home of Zelant to free Ernst from his curse.
---

It is never stated whether or not they succeed, nor how long it takes them to find the ruins where it all began. There is a chance that it may happen ::EDIT:: between Suikoden II and Suikoden III. ::/EDIT::

Now, what returning characters might this entail? Any [probably not all] of the following:

Ernst, Norma, Levi: See the character endings above. Though in terms of age, Levi might be pushing it.

Prince Falena (SuikoV), Lyon: If loaded with 108 Stars and chosen the ending that leads him, Lyon, and Georg to sail away...

Georg: Although he breaks away from Prince and Lyon at some point and ends up in Tinto, it is not stated where he ends up next.

Tir McDohl(SI), Gremio(SI), Riou(S2), Jowy(S2), Nanami(S2): Also possible loaded save file characters with 108 Stars of Destiny. A side note, a Unite Attack with Tir, Riou, Prince, and HeroVI would be interesting, as would a Unite with Gremio, Jowy, Lyon, and BestFriendVI

Wilhelm, Mueller, and Richard: Actually, The Lindwurm Mercenary Brigade, too, is from Zelant, right? It could give more insight on this mercenary group.

Eilie, Rina, Bolgan: Traveling circus troupe. At the end of Suikoden II, they are said to continue traveling, but it doesn't say where to.

Templton: After II, it says he is traveling to discover the edge of the world. Zelant is pretty far away from just about everything, who is to say he may not come and say it is near the edge of the world?

Viktor, Flik: They set out on an aimless journey after Suikoden II.

Kahn: Became a vampire hunter, but where are there vampires? With Neclord out of the question, Kahn will need to go looking for new vampires to hunt. Could Zelant become a home of vampires? Would be an interesting plot point.

Viki, Jeane: Somehow they'll make their way here. Call it gut feeling.

Silverberg X, Apple: Odessa and Mathiu have a brother. Nobody knows anything about him. Could he end up in Zelant? Also, if this unknown Silverberg is involved, Apple's avid research might lead her to him to learn more of the life of Mathiu, as she has set out to do.

Luc: I will be the first to agree his story is about as complete as it should be and having him involved would be excessive, however, because this is prior to III, it is possible he is still a disciple of Leknaat at the time, and could play a similar role to his role in I and II. (stone tablets return?)

To summarize returnable characters, without descriptions above:
Ernst
Norma
Levi
Prince Falenas*
Lyon*
Georg
Tir McDohl*
Gremio*
Riou*
Jowy*
Nanami*
Wilhelm
Mueller
Richard
Eilie
Rina
Bolgan
Templton
Viktor
Flik
Kahn
Viki
Jeane
Brother of Odessa and Mathiu Silverberg (return from mention)
Apple
Luc

* indicates character requiring loaded save with 108 stars of destiny + perfect ending

Total Possible Returning Character Count: 26

Now, for a plot, and people may say "My God, a wolf? Doesn't that borrow from Twillight Princess?" No, it very much does not, it borrows from the invasion of Muse and the final boss of Suikoden II:

HeroVI, probably has a best friend [like Gremio, Jowy, Lulu, Snowe, Lyon], has a backstory, etc etc, pretty normal, til he/she HAPPENS to come upon the ruin where Ernst, Norma, and Levi are attempting to break the curse on Ernst. Somehow the True Beast Rune is stirred by Ernst's Beast Rune and finds a host rather than a location [as in harmonia or l'renouille]. That host is HeroVI [or maybe it starts with Ernst and ends with HeroVI, like Glen to HeroIV]. Now, similarly to Ernst, HeroVI is made a beast [perhaps similar to the silver wolf in Suikoden II, as at the destruction of muse and final boss, or perhaps some other beast], however because of the fact that it's a True Rune, he is given more control than Ernst is... sometimes. This opens many plot possibilities, including more interesting recruitment scenes, and also many beast [not necessarily giant beast] stars of destiny.

I sort of rushed this speculation, but it would certainly be interesting, no?

Did I make any horrible mistakes about any of my info, btw?
Last edited by Hiyato on Sun Mar 11, 2007 12:02 am, edited 2 times in total.
~Hiyato
Wraith
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Post by Wraith »

Chizen Star: Levi
To break Ernst's curse he starts from the beginning, traveling with Ernst
and Norma across the western sea.

Tensatsu Star: Ernst
Returns home with Norma and Levi and turns toward the ruins where his curse began.

Tenyu Star: Norma
With Levi alongside, goes to her home of Zelant to free Ernst from his curse.
---

There is a chance that it may happen at around the same time as the Liberation of Toran. The Liberation of Toran takes place over the course of 3 years. Now, let's say it might occur in Zelant during the second year of that war, therefore being able to involve the Beast Rune before it winds up in Harmonia. We are never told WHEN the Beast Rune gets to Harmonia, only that the Beast Rune leaves Harmonia and goes to L'Renouille.
I'm not quite sure what you mean. Are you claiming that the Beast Rune is in Zelant? Or that Ernst has the beast Rune?

The Beast rune Ernst has is not the True Rune from S2. The correct name would've been Beast Magic rune. It's a normal rune.
Rune of Illusion
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Post by Rune of Illusion »

I like to call it the Animal Rune :D

That rune that Ernst has in Suikoden V is a derivative of the Beast Rune. Its symbol is different than the true rune.

as for Yuber, as seen in Suikoden 3 and parts of I, he rarely strays far from his summoner and his duty. So no he probably would not end up in Zelant as far as that is from Scarlett Moon and Windy.

Yuber was in Suikoden 3, but Pesmerga wasn't. So he doesn't have to be where Yuber is.

Georg went north and got involved in the Gate Rune War so I doubt he could be Zelant at the time you describe. The war lasted for four years if you count when Odessa formed the Toran Liberation Army.

These are the only things that I can see wrong with your theory. The rest has a possibility of happening. Like you said, there is no evidence of when the Beast Rune ended up in Harmonia or where they got it from.
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Hiyato
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Post by Hiyato »

I understand Ernst doesn't have the True Beast Rune like S2, however it seems that the following is in place:

1) It is said that a small village in Zelant once hid the True Beast Rune. Could that village have been made into ruins by the rune? Possibly, and it's possible that it's where Ernst/Norma/Levi are headed.

2) Ernst's Beast Rune seems to be the only one of its kind, for (correct me if I'm wrong) no other character has a Beast Magic Rune. Being the only one of its kind, it may have a similar function to the True Beast Rune as, say, the Black Sword and Bright Shield are to the True Rune of Beginning. Perhaps there is another one like it? We can only speculate.

3) It never said what happened between the True Beast Rune's residence in the small village in Zelant and the True Beast Rune's migration to Harmonia.

Now, as far as Yuber and Pesmerga goes, that much I did have a bit mixed up, and I'll fix it in my theory above.
~Hiyato
Rezard
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Post by Rezard »

Actually the beast rune was in Harmonia before it went to Highland, right?
Since there was much bloodshed and rage between Highland and Jowston, I think the beast rune was at highland for a long time.

Yuber had a contract with Windy at the time, so he couldn't be free to cause chaos in Zelant. He would be looking for the Soul Eater or fighting the liberation army.

Georg wasn´t involved in the Gate war, didn't he leave Toran because Ferid ask him to go to Falena? He was a general at some other kingdom too, according to Richmond, don't remember it well.

This topic smells fan fiction.
I sort of rushed this speculation, but it would certainly be interesting, no?
Well, another unique minor beast rune, Yuber x Persmega, more details on the True Beast rune, and to see some of the best characters of SV again are all good ideas.

But... I think this kind of script would be best to see after Suikoden II and before Suikoden III. During this time the beast rune has gone missing (they have to tell us where it is), Yuber got a second sword (people speculate Yuber defeated Persmega) and it is a good chance to see what happen with the RoB.
Wraith
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Post by Wraith »

1) It is said that a small village in Zelant once hid the True Beast Rune. Could that village have been made into ruins by the rune? Possibly, and it's possible that it's where Ernst/Norma/Levi are headed.
Where is this stated? As I've mentioned earlier I've been gone for a while. I might have missed an official statement or something.
The Prophet
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Post by The Prophet »

Yes, the True Beast Rune was held in Harmonia long before Highland was created, which would eclipse any statement about Zelant. Highland was reated when Luca's descendant Marxious (I spelled this wroung) Blight fought off a rebellion in Harmonia, consequently, the True Beast Rune chose to come to Highland, as well. That was well over 200 years ago I believe, and unless Zelant has a longer history than Harmonia, or Harmonia invaded Zelant and took the True Beast Rune, it doesn't look like it was ever held there.

As for a Beast Rune War, it would be interesting.
Hiyato
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Post by Hiyato »

Ah, I see, so this would take quite a bit of altering, I will edit my initial post.

http://suikosource.com/history/geograph ... tion_id=12
This is where it is stated that "...and a small village here used to hide a cursed Beast Rune."

Now, this leaves room for my error since I did somewhat misread it. It says "cursed" Beast Rune, but does that mean "True" beast rune, since most "True" runes hold a "Curse"?

I do agree, now that I've put a bit more time into it, that it works far better after II and before III.

The beast transformation idea in the [somewhat convoluted] outline plot I provided comes really from Ernst and the appearances of the True Beast Rune in II. I don't mean it to be in a fan fiction sense, I'm trying to surmise how the Rune, now alluded to twice in the series [if Ernst's Beast Magic rune should count], may come to play a larger role in the scheme of things.
~Hiyato
Hiyato
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Post by Hiyato »

Sorry to double post, but I have now done a bit more insight into it (though I suppose there is always more research to be done), and probably fixed a bunch of my own errors. However more errors/speculation probably exists in the field of a Beast Rune War.
~Hiyato
The Prophet
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Post by The Prophet »

I believe the "cursed" beast rune referred to there is the one Ernst has, which cannot be removed. That should not refer to the actual True Beast Rune.
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Post by Rune of Illusion »

[quote="Rezard"]

Georg wasn´t involved in the Gate war, didn't he leave Toran because Ferid ask him to go to Falena? He was a general at some other kingdom too, according to Richmond, don't remember it well.[quote]

I don't why thought that Georg was in the Gate Rune War. He was in the Succession War, but that has nothing to do with this. Yeah that rune that was in Zelant was the lesser form of the Beast Rune.
you can learn more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.
Rezard
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Post by Rezard »

Hiyato wrote:http://suikosource.com/history/geograph ... tion_id=12
This is where it is stated that "...and a small village here used to hide a cursed Beast Rune."

Now, this leaves room for my error since I did somewhat misread it. It says "cursed" Beast Rune, but does that mean "True" beast rune, since most "True" runes hold a "Curse"?
I think this rune is the magic beast rune, not the true beast rune.
If you look in Ernst and Norma biographies (in this site), you will see they mention this Small Village where Norma found the magic beast rune.

True rune often (or always) hold curses, but that doesn't mean the other runes can't hold any curses.
Hiyato wrote:I do agree, now that I've put a bit more time into it, that it works far better after II and before III.

The beast transformation idea in the [somewhat convoluted] outline plot I provided comes really from Ernst and the appearances of the True Beast Rune in II. I don't mean it to be in a fan fiction sense, I'm trying to surmise how the Rune, now alluded to twice in the series [if Ernst's Beast Magic rune should count], may come to play a larger role in the scheme of things.
Well, after Suikoden II, it will probably have passed at least 15 years, from Suikoden V. It is too much time for Ernst, Norma and Levi go back to their village and try to remove the rune. How old will them be?
They should do that in at least 2 years, even if Zelant is very far away.

Maybe if we do see Levi, Norma and Ernst in Suikoden VI as sub-plot, something happens and we see them again in other Suikoden or if Levi removes it and the rune pass to their children...

I said it was best to see a Beast rune war after SII, but I forgot to tell you that probably Ernst couldn't appear by then. It would be fun to see Ernst and the true beast rune in one plot, but it would be hard because of the time line SV was set on.
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Post by EternalOnslaught »

The Magic Beast Rune/Animal Rune/Cursed Beast Rune is derived from the True Beast Rune, it's the closest thing we have as how the True Beast Rune may act on an actual human being and not in inanimated object, I know this is slighty offtopic and I do agree that the best time for such an event to occur would be between S2 and S3 and probably the only time that it could actually happen. as for this beast rune, I need to type about it in another topic.
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lifesucksdie
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Post by lifesucksdie »

I dunno i'm drunk but I'm gonna try and explain this as well as possible.

WHAT IF:
Ernst just has the same type of rune or whatever the hell that Bob has... cept his is a different version of it... Quite possibly a lower level rune? IE: How the cyclone is a grade above the wind rune. Anyway yeah... Possible? No? And I doubt the next Suikoden story will revolve around Ernst... he might just be another star.
blahblahblah.
The Prophet
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Post by The Prophet »

Well, Bob's rune, the Rabid Fang Rune, only allowed him to stay in his human form. Bob exist naturally in his lycanthrope/werewolf form, he needs magical help to take a human form. I think that possibly his people were cursed to take the form of beast throught the power of the True Rune, but I don't believe Ernst's rune and Bob's rune shares any similarities.
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