The Return Of Barbarossa!

A place to post news and also give your ideas about the future of the Suikoden series.
Please justify all speculations with reasons why you think such an event could happen.
Sniper_Zegai
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Post by Sniper_Zegai »

Jowy Atreides wrote:Zegai, how long did it take you to come up with such an idea? Wouldn't people be expecting something along those lines? What sorts of lessons could we possibly learn from a story we've already seen (practically)? If you've actually considered these things, then forgive me.
Thats the bad thing about reading a repsonse you cant detect sarcasm. I was serious about it to a certain extent. I would'nt want that to be the entire premise for a new suikoden however I think it would make a great background story. I was mostly trying to encourage Amelia and over posters to say what they wanted ot happen in the new suikoden instead of just saying "that wont work".

If your getting the feeling Im mad at you. Im not :D ....see. I did consider what the storyline would be like and I agree with you, it would just be Suikoden 1 again. And apology accepted.
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27x4=108
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Post by 27x4=108 »

all ppl say things like that "another time same place, plot, bosses, and true runes? bah, i prefer a new suikoden" but im sure that if konami makes that "soposed" suikoden VI that some ppl sayed a lot of ppl will enjoy a lot and will be so great, like suikoden I, cuz with all bugs, bad translation and bad grafics is yet a great game!!
Sorry for my very bad english! :S
Rezard
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Post by Rezard »

Not that I hate new independent games, but I prefer the games to be linked with each other and, if possible, with lots of recurring characters. I like the suikodens series also because of this, we have secrets and can see the continuation of other character’s adventures.

You may like or not, but Barbarosa and Windy are characters who are almost sure to come back, the way they disappeared in S1 was very mysterious. Choosing to not explain what happened would be the same as not explaining why Persmega follows Yuber, Crowley vs Mazus, etc.

I didn’t like the idea of new Gate Rune war much, after all, in the end, Windy seem to lose her interest in revenge when Barbarosa says he loves her.

Perhaps they could use a different approach, like telling the story of their son as the true bearer of the sovereign rune.
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Red Killey
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Post by Red Killey »

nephlabobo wrote:No, we have fanwank.
While the term "fanwank" is a legit term, it is obvious that you had negative connotation when you posted that. I've warned both of you to leave each other alone, but you can't seem to do that and must keep on taking cheap shots at Sniper Zegai.
nephlabobo wrote:Stop trying to bait people and act like a grown up.
I'm sorry, but calling his idea as fanwank is the bait. You're the one who needs to stop doing that.
Sniper Zegai wrote:And we have A-Holes already. Oh wait no we dont. Your the first congratulations! An admin will jump on this but I could'nt let you think there were other A-holes stealing your crown.
This one is even more obvious than the other one. What were you thinking? The warning applies to both of you. Obviously you think it's okay to call him an A-Hole. Well ... it's NOT.

The two of you are now currently *this* close to being banned. I'm going to have a short discussion with the other admins and moderators to decide the punishment. I would've expected that both of you would understand the seriousness of my previous warning.
The new chief of moderating team. If you notice any problems within the discussion forum, do inform me. Thank you.
Sniper_Zegai
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Post by Sniper_Zegai »

Im sorry Red Killey. I feel like Nephabaloo is actually hounding my posts for some reason and I dont get it. Anyway I'll ignore him in the future. Sorry again Red Killey.
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nephlabobo
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Post by nephlabobo »

Rezard wrote:Not that I hate new independent games, but I prefer the games to be linked with each other and, if possible, with lots of recurring characters.
The problem is, at this point, people are focusing strictly on old characters and who they want to return, instead of looking ahead. I think they attempted to start fresh(er) with Suikoden III (and people complained).

Then they really cleaned slate with Suikoden IV - and people whined even more. (To be fair, Suiko IV *is* pretty bad, but not because of the lack of recurring characters)

Suiko V is hailed as a return to form for the series....because it has the biggest amount of nostalgia value in the games since Suiko II.

Focusing too much on old characters and old plots is just going to make someone who is new to the series say "This is too complicated" and put the game down.

Kill sales.

End the series.

I'm not saying don't have recurring characters, but we don't need to focus on them as much as people are saying the games should.
Rezard
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Post by Rezard »

The problem is, at this point, people are focusing strictly on old characters and who they want to return, instead of looking ahead.
They are just saying they want to see some characters again. Sure, some fans make some strange fan fiction, but most of us just want see our favorite characters again and the solving of some mysteries.

Suikoden V was game created simply to tell us "how George killed the queen", that was main idea behind it. This was cool and many think it will boost the sales of the next installment. The game was focused strictly on an old character, but it didn't stop the game from looking ahead.

My point is: we can have a game strictly created to tell us "what happen to Barbarosa and Windy" and they can create new villains, new heroes, new political conflicts. One thing (focusing strictly) doesn't prevent the other (looking ahead).

Of course, if they exaggerate it won't be good, but i don't feel konami will do that.
Sniper_Zegai
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Post by Sniper_Zegai »

Rezard wrote:Suikoden V was game created simply to tell us "how George killed the queen", that was main idea behind it. This was cool and many think it will boost the sales of the next installment. The game was focused strictly on an old character, but it didn't stop the game from looking ahead.
I dont agree Rezard. I did'nt have any idea georg was in Suikoden 2 until I came back on this forum and read up about him. I did'nt really concentrate on Georg in Suikoden 5 because Georg was'nt even available until near the end of the game. I beleive that with every Suikoden installment that a whole new range of characters spawns a whole new load of characters to re-appear. Not including characters from Suiko 1. How many characters from the other Suikos are there. Literally hundreds. To tell you the truth Im surprised there are'nt more returning characters. Anyway if georg is in the next Suikoden it wont prompt me to buy it anymore than if anyother character appeared. Although georg would'nt be un-welcome.
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Fury
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Post by Fury »

Rezard wrote:Suikoden V was game created simply to tell us "how George killed the queen", that was main idea behind it. This was cool and many think it will boost the sales of the next installment. The game was focused strictly on an old character, but it didn't stop the game from looking ahead.
That absolutely wasn't the premise of the game. Georg was not the main character, it was the Prince. More was invested in the Prince/Lyon, Prince/Lymsleia storyline than was with Georg.

As Zegai said, throughout the game, Georg is largely unavailable, and was even obscure to those who haven't enjoyed the success that is Suikoden II.

If that's all you got out of the game, maybe you ought to try paying attention on your next playthrough.
Rezard
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Post by Rezard »

Fury wrote:That absolutely wasn't the premise of the game. Georg was not the main character, it was the Prince. More was invested in the Prince/Lyon, Prince/Lymsleia storyline than was with Georg.

As Zegai said, throughout the game, Georg is largely unavailable, and was even obscure to those who haven't enjoyed the success that is Suikoden II.

If that's all you got out of the game, maybe you ought to try paying attention on your next playthrough.
I never said the game was centered in Georg, I said the incident where killed the queen is what originated the entire plot of the game.

Think for a while, why is the game in Falena? Why is it a litle bit after the Sucession war? Why is the hero a prince? It is all because of Richmond investigation in SII.

I can clearly see the game developers arguing about Suikoden V:

"Well, what should we do next?
Lets not talk about the most popular characters as we want the series to last longer.
Why don´t we explain how George killed the queen?
Good idea! People were wandering about Falena. So it´s Falena next.
So who should be the next hero?
Since it is history of a queen, he should the prince, if he lost his mother, it could be a opportunity to add some good drama.

(...)"

What did you imagine I was talking about? That Georg was the main character of SV, every thing that happens is because of him and he must be presented in the entire game? You must think very lowly of me.

When I said that Barbarosa could be the inspiration to a new game in the same fashion, I didn´t mean that he would be the main character of the game, present in every scene, everybody can only talk about him, he would be the only and main villain and the hero would only appear if Barbarossa allowed.

NO! I meant we could use Barbarossa to be inspiration to a new game, if he was the inspiration to a new game, it means it will be country close to Toran after the Gate rune war, it means will learn more about Windy, it means will learn more about their runes. It doesn't mean Barbarossa will be the main character of the game.

Edit: My post seems a little aggressive, but I am not mad or anything like that, I just want to make my point clear.
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Fury
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Post by Fury »

Rezard wrote:I never said the game was centered in Georg, I said the incident where killed the queen is what originated the entire plot of the game.

Think for a while, why is the game in Falena? Why is it a litle bit after the Sucession war? Why is the hero a prince? It is all because of Richmond investigation in SII.

I can clearly see the game developers arguing about Suikoden V:

"Well, what should we do next?
Lets not talk about the most popular characters as we want the series to last longer.
Why don´t we explain how George killed the queen?
Good idea! People were wandering about Falena. So it´s Falena next.
So who should be the next hero?
Since it is history of a queen, he should the prince, if he lost his mother, it could be a opportunity to add some good drama.

(...)"

What did you imagine I was talking about? That Georg was the main character of SV, every thing that happens is because of him and he must be presented in the entire game? You must think very lowly of me.

When I said that Barbarosa could be the inspiration to a new game in the same fashion, I didn´t mean that he would be the main character of the game, present in every scene, everybody can only talk about him, he would be the only and main villain and the hero would only appear if Barbarossa allowed.

NO! I meant we could use Barbarossa to be inspiration to a new game, if he was the inspiration to a new game, it means it will be country close to Toran after the Gate rune war, it means will learn more about Windy, it means will learn more about their runes. It doesn't mean Barbarossa will be the main character of the game.

Edit: My post seems a little aggressive, but I am not mad or anything like that, I just want to make my point clear.
This is what prompted my response.
Suikoden V was game created simply to tell us "how George killed the queen", that was main idea behind it.
By that quote, you sounded like you DID think the game was centered on Georg Prime.

But honestly, that investigation is no more the basis for the plot than Ted's story in Suikoden IV. He was an optional sidequest that really holds no value to Suikoden IV's overall storyline.

That's all I'm saying.

It was a new game, it's wasn't an explanation of Georg's character, however it did fit nicely within the already existing plot.

I'm not mad or anything either.
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Post by Sniper_Zegai »

I think there are many little nuggets of information hidden throughout the early Suikodens. But Fury is right you should consider the info more carefully. Its like saying "The only reason the island nations was created is because Shu said he traded with them" Which he does say before you recriut him although he calls them the island countries. Kinda funny how well it fits together.
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Rezard
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Post by Rezard »

I think Ted´s involvement in Suikoden IV was very different, he was not important to the plot, his participation seems more of a tease them an inspiration. Georg is relevant to the plot.

I find much more reasonable to think they choose to cover an event and them made the Suikoden generic plot(silent boy and fanatic bodyguard are put against someone they love and must fight evil army).
Since they are just copying the Suikoden generic plot from S1, I find more reasonable to believe they choose an event and them made a game, not otherwise.

Of course, I was not there when they made the game, but I prefer to believe in what makes more sense. That's how it goes, it is matter of faith, believe what you think makes more sense. We will never know for sure.
I think there are many little nuggets of information hidden throughout the early Suikodens. But Fury is right you should consider the info more carefully. Its like saying "The only reason the island nations was created is because Shu said he traded with them" Which he does say before you recriut him although he calls them the island countries. Kinda funny how well it fits together.
It is different also, he just mentioned a country, Richmond mentioned an incident. It is like they make a game during Crowley and Mazus duel (or little bit after, but explaining this event) and you guys would say: "the game was set there by coincidence, they didn´t want to cover their duel, they wanted to tell the history of silent hero, his fanatic bodyguard and his betraying friend." (things we have already seem many times already and will probably see more)
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27x4=108
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Post by 27x4=108 »

i dont know what thinks of a new suikoden someone who didnt know the other ones, but when i saw the first king blog that states georg was in the game i thinked "so nicee!!", then readed was in falena "oh my god, the queen , we will know all now"

i looked all georg movements in all the game, and almost trusted the idea georg didnt kill her and all was a lie from the godwins until the very end.

and about barba and windy, i think the best konami can do is to put them as a happy coule of SoD or something like that in other country and help the tenkai with the plot only a little ( like true rune help cuz the enemies have some, making a new "a lot of true runes involved" game )
Sorry for my very bad english! :S
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Post by Sniper_Zegai »

Im sorry if it sounded like I was trying to attack you Rezard because I do know what your saying. Suikoden is still a fiction and even though we like to think the writers would put more thought into the plot and charcaters. There is no reason why Konami could'nt make up a whole new game on the foundation of what a previous character said. Whats stopping them. It makes you think? Could there be a foundation for another Suikoden just waiting in the immense dialogue of previous Suikodens. :?
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