Are Suikoden fans THE problem?

[Xelinis]

Everyone, grab your pitchforks and torches.

[Templeton]

I still say that at some point we should start taking fan fiction more seriesly or atleast consider it as an alternative.

I have no examples of how this works considering Suikoden is a unique case of well thought out plot lines, setting, and character, which none other RPG series has been compared to.

In the past I have purchased Suikoden games and manga and even recently have gone out my way to have my local library purchase the Suikoden 3 manga volumes along with some of the games which are alowed to be rented out for free. If anyone can do this for their community in support of Suikoden then do it; it is all I can say so far as advice for fans to help the series. On a side note my map of the series which is right below is seen well I pray before I go to bed, (The lord's prayer to be exact, nothing personally unique). Perhaps we should be turning to religion for help and not just money numbers.

http://crystalvalleysuikoden.webs.com/a ... id=9291432

I enjoy hearing constructive personal opinions such as Novel's and people should not be interffearing with what fans are doing in support of the series.

Thank you

Ryan.

[Novelist_Games]

What an excellent post, Ryan!

I think that the suggestion to starting taking fanfiction seriously (or at least actively encouraging it, in my personal opinion) is an excellent suggestion. When I posed the same problems that we're discussing in this post with friends in my studio, one of them suggested that fanfiction was a way in which fans of a series can show their appreciation of, expand on their passion for and also spread awarness of a series. The Suikoden series does have a continuing storyline and rich history but I personally see that as a positive thing for fans of the series, as it provides them with countless references and sources to draw from!

Approaching your local library to have them stock Suikoden content is a fantastic idea! Not to patronise in any way at all but well done. It's seriously such an excellent idea. So much so, that I'm going to also try and do it myself!

Your Suikoden geography map is coming along great, keep developing it further! Thank you very much on your comment in regards to my opinions, too. Your suggestions have been excellent and if you have any more then definitely post them. This is the exact type of response that I was looking for, actual, positive suggestions of ways in which we can rectify what, yes, I personally see as a problem.

[Templeton]

As far as fansites are concerned we had a valuable resource at work for Due Fiumi which at some point came along with interactive updates. This site should not fail because it works as a "Memory Alpha" (Star Trek), or Wookiepedia (Star Wars) type fan work that is a great treasure of detailed information. Someone needs to reach out to John Layfield or else a big part of the fan base will be cut off of interactive information.

I try my best to create a sense of community with my Universal Suikoden Forums Encyclopedia which is in my signature box. My site CrystalValley.Suikoden is meant to be a political site dedicated to, mostly at this point, creating unity among Tierkries and the main series.

As far as additional advice is concerned then if you, or any especially extended posters could do, is put the USFE signature in their box and allow fans to access the information. As well if you encounter a site in your travels which has a designated advertisement forum then please direct them to Suikosource.

My forums are in the USFE near the top and you can access the site from there, and might I add, the purpose of the discussion there is to allow views such as Novels to be expressed.

Thank you

Ryan.

[amelia108]

i would like to say that i enjoyed tierkreis, but don't consider it one of the best rpgs on the ds. it was merely a pretty good standalone rpg and was overall a disappointment for regular fans as it pretty much denied their existence (zero connection to the old games; they could have thrown a tiny bone or two but nada). i enjoyed the game for its duration but wouldnt care for more of the same, and would likely not even touch a tierkreis 2.

that said, i also totally disagree with it having more of the "suikoden feeling" than 4. i started with 1 and i define that as what suikoden "should be" (for lack of a better term) and 4 felt a lot like 1 in a lot of ways; more so than any of the others. that's me though.

i do wish more fans weren't typically so negative without giving out some sort of pros too (no matter how small) but that's really every fandom in existence, so what can i say... oh well?

[Rooks]

As a whole, I support fan involvement in the series, including fan fiction and fan-made games. I think this shows that there is still a vibrant community supporting the Suikoden games, beyond numbers and money, and the fact that this exists is a testament to the games themselves.

But honestly, we need to come to the realization that the series will end eventually. Everything comes to an end given enough time, and Suikoden is no exception. I'm not saying that S VI or even S VII will not happen, but rather that no mater how many sequels are to come, there will eventually be a final game in the series, and at that point, it will be up to the fans to keep the Suikoden games alive in one way or another.

Before modern copyright laws, stories were past down and re-written by each new era of writers. Troilius and Cressida, for one, was a classical Greek play, rewritten by Boccaccio, Chauser, and Shakespeare, each in their own generation, and each with their own particular take on the basic story. Water Margin itself seems to have been written by two different authors, and has seen hundreds of interpretations, of which the Suikoden games are just one.

So, in a sense, the Suikoden games are derived from the basic Water Margin story, just as how fan fiction is derived from the basic Suikoden story. I would like to encourage fans of the games to write their own fan fiction, but I think it is an important step to write your own stories and scripts that are not directly connected to the games themselves. Use what you have learned and the aspects that you like most about the games in your own world and your own environment. This too, is another way to make the games live on long after the last sequel has been released.

[KC_MCDOHL]

I find this an interesting and ironic topic.

In short, I don't think Suikoden fans are the problem, no. Konami has more than its fair share to answer for when it comes to the series' questionable motives and decline.

However, I do feel that Suikoden fans (and perhaps most gamers for that matter) do tend to do a lot of complaining about what games they dont like or what game elements they don't like. Everyone is entitled to there opinion, of course, but I feel that there is alot of unnecesary negativity in the Suikoden community. There is clearly alot of passion in Suikosource, it is a site I still visit (and have for many years) and therefore I have a lot of respect for it, but I do not entirley like what this webste has become. What Suikosource has given to Suikoden fans is, undoubtedly, great. And what Suikosource has achieved in the past has been awesome! I feel the forum has now become a board where bored Suikoden fans come to bicker between eachother in the absence of any positive news from Konami. This has been on-going for a while and has probably further intesified alongside the general contempt for Konami's handling of our beloved series.

It says something about us all that we have created a topic called 'Are Suikoden fans THE problem?' and then proceeded to bicker, 'argue' and contradict within that very topic! lol! (I too have now been sucked into this inevetable abyss)

Anyhow, as I have said before, there is clearly alot of passion on this website. I feel that, the energy we continue to pour into the forum in the form of conflicting opinions, theories, hypothesis, arguments, bickering, can instead be channeled into something far more positive. Because at the end of the day, we all agree on one thing - we love Suikoden.

There are many things we can do. For example, the neglected petition to have the Suikoden 1+2 novels translated into English can be revived with much more of our support and, of course, our signatures! I realise that the petition is a seperate argument and there are no doubt lots of cons insted of pros to consider, but this is just one of many examples. What I'm alluding to is that, as people with lots of passion, and cleary alot to say about our series ...lets actualy try and do something about it. Something positive. And our passion and positivity will inspire more of our fans to follow suit.

So, I propose - enough of the unnecesary whingeing and lets do something positive for our beloved series. Lets actualy TRY and influence Suikoden. Lets not sit and moan about the lack of news from Konami - lets make our OWN news! ...Lets get a result

[Thiamor]

I read the posts on page 2 about the FF series, yet I bet none of you even know why FF was made.
To begin with, there was only meant to be just 1 Final Fantasy, and that was a chance at (hoping) to make a good, final game before they went bankrupt. They were failing on their games, not getting enough funding or a large enough fan-base to sustain them long enough. They were told to make one more, final game. That is why it was also called Final Fantasy. As seen as their final game.

Just had to say that. But to be a smart game designing company, you must listen to what the people want. You're not making it for no one, you're making it for someone. If they don't like it, then they don't get the money they want. Thus leading to a bankruptcy in the long run if continuing to not listen to their fans. Their fans are what makes them...them. Not just the ability to make and distribute lame, general RPG games whenever they so damn please. If fans want all Suikoden games to be connected, then they should do it. Why else make games, if not for the people?

[Vextor]

I read the posts on page 2 about the FF series, yet I bet none of you even know why FF was made.
To begin with, there was only meant to be just 1 Final Fantasy, and that was a chance at (hoping) to make a good, final game before they went bankrupt. They were failing on their games, not getting enough funding or a large enough fan-base to sustain them long enough. They were told to make one more, final game. That is why it was also called Final Fantasy. As seen as their final game.

I knew that story, mainly because I was in Japan back then. I also played most all of Square's games before Final Fantasy (including when they used to call themselves "DOG"). They sure did make crappy games tho.

[Raww Le Klueze]

It's also the world's most well-known video game creation story in memory, short of the false Pac-Man = Pizza slice one.

[Templeton]

The situation between Final Fantasy and Suikoden kinda reminds me of the situation and history between Canada and America.

It's sometimes fun in our country trying to make fantasies about being a superior power to them one day. But the truth is it won't happen.

Neverthless we come to our senses and realize that we should keep things friendly and work together so that one anothers interests are pursued co-operatly.

Basically what I'm saying is that wars are dirty business and Suikoden fans must realize that we should maintain our middle power status and try to see a parrellel vision of perhaps our idea's being shared to our mutual benefit between our Dragon Quest/Final Fantasy/Breath of Fire/etc neighboors; after all, if I'm not mistaken the history of Suikodens creation does go back to Final Fantasy 6's influence on Murayama.

Thank you

Ryan.

[Vextor]

after all, if I'm not mistaken the history of Suikodens creation does go back to Final Fantasy 6's influence on Murayama.

Suikoden's creation doesn't have anything to do with Final Fantasy 6 at all, so not sure where you may have heard this. Murayama himself wanted to create an FPS, but in a random discussion with Konami executives he threw out an idea of an RPG that is like Shui Hu Zhuan (mainly so the old executive can understand the concept), but the executive took the idea literally and gave the order to make a Shui Hu Zhuan-like RPG.

[Templeton]

In that case I guess I was mistaken.

[Vextor]

And after getting that order, Murayama worked on creating the Suikoden world rather quickly without expecting any sequel being created. The effect of this can be seen by how early Konami information shows that they intended for the world to have 36 True Runes instead of 27, etc.

[Templeton]

* I refuse to change the topic of this discussion any further...