Hero 6's Job Class...

[ninjaluc79]

If there's one thing that I think why Suikoden is different from other games is that the most popular Suikoden heroes are from the monk/fighter class. It is a unique job class for a protagonist, considering that most RPGs field in a swordsman/warrior as the main protagonist, with females from the priest/white mage class as their love interests.

For one, Riou from S2 is a unique monk-class hero because his Bright Shield Rune can heal the whole party. I think that's pretty unusual for the protagonist to become a healer, but well, it worked out fine, because there are also a lot of strong and unique characters in S2 like Viktor, Flik (a magic swordsman), Luc, etc.

I had two sets of final teams in S2.

Team 1: Riou, the circus trio, Viktor and Flik. Viktor, Flik, and Bolgan are my main attackers, whereas Eilie and Riou are my back-up healers, while Rina is my main nuker despite her MAG stat being much lower than Luc's.

Team 2: Riou, Viktor, Flik, Luc, Eilie, and Rina. Viktor and Flik are now my main attackers, Eilie as back-up healer to Riou, Luc and Rina as magic damagers, though Luc always defends when not using spells.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Hugo is from the Thief class (with the twin daggers, minus the steal), Geddoe is a Rune Swordsman, while Chris is a Knight.

Suikoden 4 (I think) was the first time in the series that the main protagonist was from the swordsman/warrior class. That's Lazlo with his twin swords.

Then Suikoden went back to tradition when they debuted Kyril and the Falenian Prince (I forgot his name), again from the fighter class.

It would be great if Suikoden had an archer or mage as the next protagonist, considering I have yet to see an RPG with an archer as the main protagonist. The Final Fantasy series have Rydia (FF4) and Terra (FF6) as main protagonists from the mage class.

[Palmguy]

I don't think Suikoden works well with Final Fantasy based class system. I don't see them as Monk, white/black mage, fighter, warrior, etc. I see them more with things like "Ninja", "Narcissist", "Warrior-Mage Hybrid", "Bandit" and things like that. Oh, and don't say that they are the same things with different names. Like, Bandit = Thief. Faylen is probably the furthest thing from a "Thief" class ever, yet, she's a bandit.

[Neclord X]

I think Suikoden characters aren't monk/martial arts class. They look like them and use that contundent weapons but their stats arent "monk classed".

All they are characters half mage-half warrior (they have considerable VP, MP, hight attack but also high magic...) so they aren't monks but not other class either.

It would be great if Suikoden had an archer or mage as the next protagonist, considering I have yet to see an RPG with an archer as the main protagonist. The Final Fantasy series have Rydia (FF4) and Terra (FF6) as main protagonists from the mage class.

Well, it's a good idea make a hero from a concrete class but if you ask me, i would prefer Berserker class, with claws/axe.

Or, the chance to select wich class you want.

[eldrasidar]

the problem with an archer is that archers are a defensive fighting style. Archers prefer to be as far away from the enemy, while stille being able to shoot them. In close combat, they get cut down incredibly quickly, as they don't wear heavy armor, since it would interfere with their shooting, and they aren't likely to be train in hand to hand, let alone be equipped for it. Likewise, most Mages are reluctant to be in a combat situation, because they get cut down in a second. So if you want a mage or archer to be leading your army, expect him or her to be chilling 200 feet safely out of reach, while the rest of the stars of destiny take all the damage. The only way you could really work a bow or crossbow in, would be if the character had some kind of hybrid weapon that included a single shot weapon( gunblade?)

there's a reason why there's never more than a handful of archers or mages(like Crowley, not mage knights like Kyle) in any Suikoden.

[Palmguy]

No, a mage could work also. Think of how you duel Sasarai/Luc in Suiko3. It worked.

[eldrasidar]

Gasp! they were clones, so it's pretty much an even duel. Dueling Sasarai with Hugo is much different. Sasarai gets the first shot, being a ranged guy, then hugo stabs him to death with his knife. Essentially, you get one shot to kill him before you get slaughtered. More importantly, Sasarai only went into the duel because nobody else would, and he need some excuse to withdraw, not because he actually wanted to fight. The way the duel system works, mages are terrible, since they don't actually get to use any of their magic, and mages have terrible combat skills. Which is why you only ever duel Luc with Sasarai, because both of them are equally lousy at dueling. Every other encounter with Luc is in war or normal combat, which in theory would be more fair to him, except that his True Rune is nerfed, so he is a really slow caster.

If you wanted hero six to be a caster, you couldn't involve him in duels without either A: changing the system to allow magic, which would invariably favor hero 6, or you'd have to seriously nerf the duel opponents.

[thcrock]

the problem with an archer is that archers are a defensive fighting style. Archers prefer to be as far away from the enemy, while stille being able to shoot them. In close combat, they get cut down incredibly quickly, as they don't wear heavy armor, since it would interfere with their shooting, and they aren't likely to be train in hand to hand, let alone be equipped for it. Likewise, most Mages are reluctant to be in a combat situation, because they get cut down in a second. So if you want a mage or archer to be leading your army, expect him or her to be chilling 200 feet safely out of reach, while the rest of the stars of destiny take all the damage. The only way you could really work a bow or crossbow in, would be if the character had some kind of hybrid weapon that included a single shot weapon( gunblade?)

there's a reason why there's never more than a handful of archers or mages(like Crowley, not mage knights like Kyle) in any Suikoden.

My problem with this argument is that Riou wasn't a tank. He was an okay attacker, but no stronger or more resilient than most archers. I often had him in the back row. A mage could work too, if the battle system is balanced. Sword vs Bow vs Magic...its all just damage. Traditionally mages in Suikoden have had very weak armor but there's no reason they can't have defense up buff spells or accessories (like a Canopy Defense ring). Just take a look at WRPGs where you can customize your main character. I went through Baldur's Gate with a mage hero, no problem. The battle system just has to be designed to suit it.

[27x4=108]

It depends on the True Rune ( or special rune ) that the Tenkai wields, and it depends too on the basic team, in Suikoden you have Cleo, Gremio and Pahn, so it wouldnt be a problem if Tir wasnt a real monster, in II you have Viktor and Nanami that usually pwn a lot with his multiple atacks and his speed, and so on in the others..

[eldrasidar]

I never said the Tenkai had to be a tank, merely somebody who would be willing to get up close and personal with his opponents. That said, although Riou is not as good as some of the other characters in the game at doing physical combat, he has does have above average stats for STR, TEC, SPD, and LUK, all of which makes him a solid combat character, and with the exception of SPD, his stats growths in those categories are higher than all the archers in Suikoden 2. Granted, though, that Riou is basically identical in terms of armor.

Gameplay wise, there is no reason, why the main character couldn't be an archer or mage, as Suikoden doesn't really do a lot to distinguish stars based purely on weapons, and since with enough Runes, you can pretty much make any character good in combat or magic. And of course, with a party of 6, it's pretty easy to cover any particular members weaknesses.

My argument is pretty much that the kind of characters that become archers or mages, aren't really leaders. Mages tend to be either advisors, or egotistical seekers of knowledge and/or power, and archers tend to lone hunters. Will both fight with the 108 stars to achieve their own ends, sure, but they aren't going to lead an army, unless of course suikoden 6 is the remake of the Tale of Robin Hood, then sure, but even Robin Hood, a famous archer, was also known for his skills with swords and other martial arts, as is nearly every other historical or mythical leader known for their archery. It would be odd for a leader to specialize in archery or magic to the exclusion of close combat. there simply isn't a precedent for it in a non steampunk fantasy world.

[Palmguy]

The first Atelier Iris, the main lead was a male Mage, so it's possible for them to be the leader.

[eldrasidar]

that would qualify as steampunk in my book.

[ninjaluc79]

I think Suikoden characters aren't monk/martial arts class. They look like them and use that contundent weapons but their stats arent "monk classed".

All they are characters half mage-half warrior (they have considerable VP, MP, hight attack but also high magic...) so they aren't monks but not other class either.

It would be great if Suikoden had an archer or mage as the next protagonist, considering I have yet to see an RPG with an archer as the main protagonist. The Final Fantasy series have Rydia (FF4) and Terra (FF6) as main protagonists from the mage class.

Well, it's a good idea make a hero from a concrete class but if you ask me, i would prefer Berserker class, with claws/axe.

Or, the chance to select wich class you want.

Which is why I thought monk-class characters are the balanced ones...

In Ragnarok Online, there was this popular build for the Monk Class there... A balanced build with points added to almost all stats which kicks ass due to its possible one-hit KO skill, the Asura Strike...

And I would like to mention that I conferred with my friend that Asian mages were more physically fit than Western mages, but the latter being much more magically powerful. And since Suikoden is Japanese-produced, I was thinking that if the case is that the Suikoden heroes aren't monk types, then they could possibly be some sort of an Asian mage class.

Speaking about duels with a mage class protagonist, well, it doesn't have to be mage vs. other classes. Try a Mage vs. Mage duel! A la Crowley vs. Mazus.

[Hirathien]

And why exactly can't a leader be a mage? Because he's squishy? Eh, what? I'll have you know, it's not that many "Leaders" who would rush out in combat, and be on the very frontline. Kill the leader, the battle is lost.

Feels more like you got a wet dream to play a guy who's in charge, running in, takes it all.

Jesus.

[ninjaluc79]

Or, it doesn't have to be a real mage with all the crappy HP and DEF...

You could have as the hero a mage knight, as well. Just ask FF6's Terra Bradford.

If you don't like, you can have a thief class(with or w/o steal is just fine). FF9's Zidane Tribal kicked ass too.

[Neclord X]

Which is why I thought monk-class characters are the balanced ones...

In Ragnarok Online, there was this popular build for the Monk Class there... A balanced build with points added to almost all stats which kicks ass due to its possible one-hit KO skill, the Asura Strike...

And I would like to mention that I conferred with my friend that Asian mages were more physically fit than Western mages, but the latter being much more magically powerful. And since Suikoden is Japanese-produced, I was thinking that if the case is that the Suikoden heroes aren't monk types, then they could possibly be some sort of an Asian mage class.

Speaking about duels with a mage class protagonist, well, it doesn't have to be mage vs. other classes. Try a Mage vs. Mage duel! A la Crowley vs. Mazus.

Monk are never balanced Class. In Raganarok you can make a balanced monk like you can make a balanced Rune Knight, or in Dragon Age you can make a tank from a mage. Since the kind of game MMRPG-like allows to great character development.

But usually jrpg are other world, monks/fighters "class" (FF; Atelier Series, Personas, Dragon Quest, etc) are known for their high Vit and power and some backup skills, they are far away from "balanced class".