Snowe - spoilers inside!

Blue Sasarai · Post by **Blue Sasarai** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 2:15 pm

nice ^^ thanks for the info. i shall do that, and dress him up all pretty

<~~wants to many a funny snowe plushie now *lol*

Eao · Post by **Eao** » Wed Mar 16, 2005 11:31 am

I'd collaborate but I'm not good. I stoped at making a Yuber doll. I'd be glad to hand it on to somone else, who'll want to dress it. unfortunatiy his hair braid is wrong...i heard its the kind where you use 4 braids...oh well.

anway yeh.. plushies!

Post by **Oppenheimer** » Wed Mar 16, 2005 12:20 pm

I never did get Snowe's other outfits because it was such a menial chore. You have to go to the right area, set out your net, set sail and then just sit in the boring water. . . then ten minutes later pull the net in and check to see if you got anything of value. I did that for about an hour and a half and got every other rare item in that area but not Snowe's outfit. Eventually I just kept getting Salmon or whatever fish was in the area. I dislike aspects of the game that are random waiting things like that. There should have been a quest you could go on with Snowe to get his outfits back. That could have developed his character more and also made the task less boring.

And on side note:

Crowley's_Apprentice wrote:when snowe gets his white pirate outfit with the collar... wow... he looks like a flamin' homo!!!!!!!!!!!!

That was extremely inappropriate. Please keep your prejudiced comments to yourself. Besides most people that I have talked to prefer that outfit.

ReikenGaryu · Post by **ReikenGaryu** » Wed Mar 16, 2005 1:33 pm

To give my view on Snowe:

I think Snowe is the result of constant pressure and disregard. His father pressured him into a position he wasn't ready for yet. Glen knew this, obviously, yet he did blame Snowe for screwing up. Also, he punched Snowe in the face while Snowe's subordinates were standing around; a MAJOR disregard to his rank, which made Snowe's own troops dislike him even more.

Then, Snowe even tried to redeem himself, buying some medicine for Glen, yet to no avail; Glen basically waves the gesture away. Earlier on, when he says his arm is 'hurt', his soldiers ignore his decision and listen to the hero; a correct judgement from the soldiers, but once again, it really made Snowe feel like an outcast even more.

I think Snowe was never cut out to be a leader, yet forced into the spot. Forced to work harder than he could, and then blamed when things go wrong. Yep, that's gonna play with your head in a while. And then, an event comes along in which everything suddenly backfires, your captain dies, your old friend who seemingly took your honor away close to the dead body... The conclusions he made there were wrong, too swift, and stupid, yet completely understandable for somebody who was already way beyond a comprehensible way of thinking.

Snowe then sets out to join Kooluk, basically, giving up Razril to them. Why? To save them? Or for personal glory? Egotistical or not, it's understandable once again Snowe wanted this recognition from Kooluk, and the recognition from the people of Razril for the fact he, in his mind, 'saved' them from an even more barren fate.

Cast out, he becomes a pirate. Too bad Konami didn't explain this. Some cutscenes to how this came to be would have helped a lot. Eitherway, Snowe would suddenly find himself in the position he saw the hero in a while back; a cast-out joining pirates. Again, he stood in his shadow, but perhaps he had now found a new road in his life...

Given time to think, see the situation from many different viewpoints, Snowe ends up admitting his faults, and accepts the hero as his leader, joining up with him. Still, it felt hard on him. This was not what he had expected his life to be, but he accepted it, though not easily. In the end, he is accepted back into Razril, and lives as a regular citizen, a role that fits him quite well for someone who had been shot down from his ivory tower, forced to experience all ranks of civilisation.

Yup, I think Snowe is a good character in a nutshell, but, as may be obvious, Konami gave too little for us to connect all these pieces together... I hope my post will get some people to think more about this whole thing.

Post by **Oppenheimer** » Wed Mar 16, 2005 1:59 pm

I'm torn. I'm a huge fan of realism in video games, but I don't know if I want so much realism that it gets boring. Snowe is a realistic character in that he has cowardess and is unsure of himself.

The last scene with Snowe in it, just before the hero goes to bed did make me realize how he is just a nobody now. That's also what his ending credit points out. He just lives a normal life. He wasn't anything special in the end. Perhaps that's why I didn't care much about him? But on the other hand people living quiet lives can be interesting. I was one of the few people who liked Thomas in Suikoden III and most of his scenario was not anything heroic and fantastical.

I did find Snowe interesting at the beginning of the game, up until you get exiled. I liked how he tried to give medicine to Glen and how Glen would punish him for his cowardess. But then I lost interest in Snowe, and the few appearances of him didn't interest me anymore. I have to admit on my first chance to execute him I choose to do so. I felt he was disloyal and just getting in the way now and felt nothing for him, I just wanted him out of the way so I could get back to the story. But, I felt bad afterwards. The execution scene when he reminded me of the torch bearing episode was quite touching, so I reset.

What I think would have been better is if Snowe accompanied you when you were exiled (not necessarily voluntarily). That way he could have been continuously developed. Or better yet the game would have been interesting if the whole story was from Snowe's perspective. But, I suppose 108 people rallying around Snowe would not suit his character. Perhaps the best of both worlds would be a Dual Sight System ala Suikoden III, where you played as the Hero and then Snowe and switched back and forth.

Blue Sasarai · Post by **Blue Sasarai** » Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:39 pm

Eao wrote:I'd collaborate but I'm not good. I stoped at making a Yuber doll. I'd be glad to hand it on to somone else, who'll want to dress it. unfortunatiy his hair braid is wrong...i heard its the kind where you use 4 braids...oh well.

anway yeh.. plushies!

aw he sounds cute ^^ what did u make the braid with?
i really should start making suik plushies, i did make a doremi plush already ^^

Eao · Post by **Eao** » Thu Mar 17, 2005 3:22 pm

To Blue Sas: I used Yarn for his hair, Snow, I figure would be best made with a series of faux fur, the problem is the polygons and the character art seem to be a bit inconsistant with color, finding a cream/platinum blond fur would be hard.

To Oppenheimer: I don't know if that would work, he even states in the game "i don't undersrand why people flock to you", I to hate social butterflys. I don't get it, some people do nothing to have a following. or in my world again, ad nausuem "OMG u art look real". Snowe having his own SoD sounds like he may not have 108. besides his story dosen't seem to be that of "some adventure/quest of doing stuff", if any thing happens its just deep, inside and self relection, finding who your really are and where you belong. that is done solo, and having a following to help do so just deludes you further, if not, by viewing their actions and interactions with you. think hard and that will make sence.

Then, Snowe even tried to redeem himself, buying some medicine for Glen

don't you have a chose to say "snowe broght it" or "i brought it"? or was that food? I said "I got it for him", Snowe was being a punk so, he deserved no credit.

to whomever wants to see Snowe's adventres: go to Live Journal. there was a funny closed RP there. now well, its "side story madness".

There should have been a quest you could go on with Snowe to get his outfits back. That could have developed his character more and also made the task less boring.

haha i so need to draw a pic of hero4 and him all chibi and screaming in glee "lets go shopping!"

xXSqualleoNXx · Post by **xXSqualleoNXx** » Thu Mar 17, 2005 4:21 pm

If I rember correctly, Yes, you could be a jackass and say you got it. I don't remember what he exactly says but it certainly was nicer than how he responded if it was Snowe's.

This leads me to something I just though. Why would Snowe's father thought Hero killed Glen because he wanted to be treated even better than the Knights when Glen WAS treating Hero much better than most other Knights. As a matter of fact, He allows Hero to hear conversations between Him and the Vice-Commander, to which SNowe just snits "Why does [Hero] gets to hear it?". Katarina must have really been blinded by hatred to think Hero had any reason to kill Glen.

Vincent of Scarlet Moon · Thu Mar 17, 2005 4:31 pm

Remember, this is basically what everyone saw.

Snowe: Saw the Tenkai's hand glow, Glen warns Snowe, Glen dies, turns to ash.

Tenkai: His hand glowed, Glen warns Snowe, Glen dies, turns to ash.

While the Tenkai knew he didn't MURDER Glen Cott, he couldn't say with 100% certainty that he wasn't responsible for his death in some way. Snowe didn't know about the curse of the Rune of Punishment. The Tenkai didn't, hey, he only realised he had it when he woke up AFTER the sentence was passed.

The reason why the Tenkai was exiled was because Glen Cott died in suspicious circumstances but without the evidence to warrant an execution. And [spoiler]considering that Glen was the father of Katarina and she never got to tell him, [/spoiler]it's not surprising that she'd be angry, not just at the Tenkai but at everyone.

Meanwhile Lord Vingerhut just believed what his son said word-for-word along with a skewed memory of the past. Like a lot of parents would have for their son or daughter.

Glen saw potential in the Tenkai, that's why he was treated well, but not that much better than he might have treated others. This preferential treatment consisted of saying that he didn't want the Tenkai to be delivering his meals to his bed, and letting him hear one conversation.

xXSqualleoNXx · Post by **xXSqualleoNXx** » Thu Mar 17, 2005 4:49 pm

They didn't have a lot of time to work their relationship out. I'm pretty sure Glen saw the Tenkai more fit as a leader than Snowe. I guess I couldn't have said better treatment but essentially Glen treats Hero better than most others. I'm pretty sure Hero was forced to do "menial chores", as Glen puts it, Because of his status as servant. Heck, Hero slept alone in a small room near the kitchen instead of the Knights Dormitory(We never saw this place). The only reason I mention how Glen treated him different was because Katarina knew this and yet she STILL thought Hero killed him without even showing some doubt or asking Hero if he had done so. They basically just carry the sentence without giving the Hero ANY chance to explain.

BTW, we still don't know who Glen was warning though. He couldn't even get up, the only reason he wsas looking right at Snowe was because Snowe moved him enough to have him facing each other.

Vincent of Scarlet Moon · Thu Mar 17, 2005 4:58 pm

True, but I'm giving the evidence from the view of the two witnesses.

But, what could the Tenkai say besides pretty much what Snowe said? "My hand glowed an evil glow and the commander warned one of us. Then he died, from a similar glow."? All he can say is "I didn't kill him, he just, erm, died."

That's why he didn't get executed, after all, there wasn't even a body.

As far as the Tenkai, Snowe, Katarina and Lord Vingerhut knew what happened was that Snowe made his way to the roof, where he saw that the Tenkai was gripping his hand as it glowed. Then Glen collapsed to the ground in agony and Snowe pushed his way forward to help. Glen muttered a warning to get out of there, then he died.

From that point of view, it's hard for the Tenkai to explain anything. He didn't have a clue either.

xXSqualleoNXx · Post by **xXSqualleoNXx** » Thu Mar 17, 2005 5:06 pm

The fact that Katarina saw Glen groaning in pain from that "same" strange light might have indicated something was indeed wrong. Katarina saw the rune too, he might now have known what rune it was but the least she could do is give him the benefit of the dsoubt and just have him arrested whilke they investigate. Needless to say what we saw was dictatorship at his best, The dictator being Lord Vingerhut himself.

ReikenGaryu · Post by **ReikenGaryu** » Fri Mar 18, 2005 9:51 am

Katarina hadn't seen the rune on Hero. She first saw it in the Pirate's Nest, judging from her reaction there.

Post by **Oppenheimer** » Fri Mar 18, 2005 10:04 am

You'd think the hero would be able to piece together what happens when the rune in transfered, based on watching Brandeau turn to ash and Glen getting the rune. But, even if he did know what was going on it wouldn't matter since he has no voice to defend himself with.

What surprised me was that Katrina asks the hero if he did kill Glen when she meets him in the Pirates nest. That she still believed it showed her to be very short sighted, in my opinion.

demon eye · Post by **demon eye** » Fri Mar 18, 2005 10:36 am

Hero 4 knew exactly what happened to Glen, but it was hard for him to explain it to others either way. Just think about it, not many people are aware of a True Rune's power. Now he tells them a rune on his hand caused the Captain to become instantly cremated, do you think anyone would believe him? Also, if they did believe him, they would just want to use him as a weapon..as we see him being used in the story. So, it was best that he kept his mouth shut about the whole event.

Katarina was not short-sighted. She had no idead what the Rune of Punishment could do. Snowe and the Hero were the last ones to see Glen. Katarina had no choice but to side with the the Vingerfuts even if she didn't believe the Hero was capable of killing Glen. She just asked him again to clear her mind of any doubt she may have had. Also, in actuality, the Hero did have something to do with Glen's death as the Rune of Punishment seemed to wish to be passed on to the Hero and may have 'ashed' Glen a little earlier than most to get what it desired. But, if you want to be technical Glen commited suicide from overusing the Rune of Punishment's power.